[Official] Classic Revamp [Quenched]

[Robinette]

It's nice to have those cities,
but i sure don't like how wrong it makes where they appear to be...
Hope somebody can think up a perfect solution.


oh, and the Left globe looks bigger to me,
i'm sure it's just a combination of the extra letters and the background color being darker, but it really caught my eye.

[isaiah40]

I like version 6 better. I didn't notice the pointers until I read the post.

[pamoa]

Maybe with that pointer logic you can replace Madrid by Paris

[General Brock II]

Good show, chaps! This map looks like an incredible replacement for that pseudo map we call 'classic'. I would recommend the use of Toronto in Canada rather than Montreal, but no matter.

[saaimen]

I'm sorry, I wouldn't go for the pointers.

[sully800]

Also, I should point out that the city in the Philippines should indeed be Manila and not Singapore.

[Evil DIMwit]

The pointers look kind of out of place in that they're all concentrated in one corner of the map.

Also, now Anchorage and Port Moresby stick out as much less prominent than the others. How recognizable is Anchorage to non-Americans? I know I haven't heard of Port Moresby before. If you're already going with pointers you can try applying them at these other points of the map (maybe including Denver or Honolulu instead of Anchorage; not sure about Oceania)

[skeletonboy]

great to see a new classic map, nice work. One issue, at the top it still says magadan where on the map it has been changed to seoul

[MrBenn]

Hmmm

I'm not convinced that the pointers work that well - primarily because they're all bunched up in the same place, and the labels look like they're in the wrong place (I think it just looks a bit weird and distorted); which is a shame, because I had hoped that they'd be the perfect solution...

As it is, I think the version without pointers is much better, and feels a lot more natural...

[sully800]

Hmmm

I'm not convinced that the pointers work that well - primarily because they're all bunched up in the same place, and the labels look like they're in the wrong place (I think it just looks a bit weird and distorted); which is a shame, because I had hoped that they'd be the perfect solution...

As it is, I think the version without pointers is much better, and feels a lot more natural...

I tend to agree. I could put pointers in other places on the map, but I wanted to test Asia first since that is the area of highest concern. As I said, the new cities are great but I think the layout is a bit more confusing and jumbled.

Port Moresby and Anchorage are pretty small, along with Edmonton, Reykavijk, a couple African cities. That is the nature of the beast though, it's not possible to get all very well known cities on the map because of the way they are distributed. I'm just hoping to get the best possible clear version, and so far I like version 5 a bit better.

[sdhillson]

I agree that the pointers don't really work, but one remote Russian city can be removed from V6 by at least moving Tokyo to Manila and Magadan to Tokyo making it the new exit point. I realize that wasn't the territory that represented Japan in the original game, but as you said, we don't have "to choose cities simply because they come from the countries that were arbitrarily chosen for some other map" (I realize this is slightly out of context, but it works here too).

I still have reservations about no connection from China to SE Asia and Tehran to Istanbul, but I guess I'll have to live with them.

[sdhillson]

I actually just had a totally different idea that might be crazy, but it might work. What if you create a map within a map of an area essentially centered and zoomed in on Shanghai w/ Hong Kong, Beijing, Seoul, Tokyo, and Vladivostok. Have this zoomed in map overlay most of NE Russia and just draw the connections straight into the overlayed map. It might take me a day to do a mock-up of this, but it would solve all the problems: China as the center of Asia, un-cramp the Far east, use up empty space in NE Russia, include lots of cities around the Yellow Sea.

I realize this could be a lot of work and you'd lose the more natural image of the continents, but it would be more true to the idea of including the major world cities.

[Robinette]

I actually just had a totally different idea that might be crazy, but it might work. What if you create a map within a map of an area essentially centered and zoomed in on Shanghai w/ Hong Kong, Beijing, Seoul, Tokyo, and Vladivostok. Have this zoomed in map overlay most of NE Russia and just draw the connections straight into the overlayed map. It might take me a day to do a mock-up of this, but it would solve all the problems: China as the center of Asia, un-cramp the Far east, use up empty space in NE Russia, include lots of cities around the Yellow Sea.

I realize this could be a lot of work and you'd lose the more natural image of the continents, but it would be more true to the idea of including the major world cities.

so could you make it like a magnifying glass?

mnnnnn.... that might just work,
i have certainly used a real magnifying glass many times to look at detail on real maps ...yeah, i know, i'm such a geek

[The Neon Peon]

I think the new legend looks very nice.

I think the only graphics change now to make is to center the title above Europe and Africa.

Agree with the others about the pointers not working. Just leave it inaccurate. No one will care if the map looks great.

[Nzen]

As iterated before, the pointers do not add much. To really distinguish them from the paths would require expanding the army circles farther apart - even halfway into the surrounding oceans - so the pointers really stand out. Very likely, spreading the circles will detract from the whole.

Nevertheless, don't worry about using 'unacknowledged' cities like Anchorage and Novosibirsk. Playing on the community's maps has imbued a more nuanced understanding of foreign geography in me. The Iraq map is particularly nice in removing a layer of abstraction from distant lands and peoples. In this sense, using more recognizable Asian cities is nice, but may not inspire the curiousity (and foregone complaints) that, say, Vientiane might prompt.

Also, the Lagos - Cape Town connection covers a big slice of the African coastline. I suggest curving into the ocean as you have done for almost every other coastal connection.

[sdhillson]

As promised, here are some mock-ups with the magnification of the Far East:

then with Hong Kong + Yellow Sea in the magnified area:

Then just Yellow Sea:

My preference is HK+YS (2nd), then whole Far East (1st), then just Yellow Sea (3rd); HK+YS is not quite as distorted, gives a little more spacing between HK and Manila, and no double-crossing of the magnified border from Astana to HK (but that might not be a problem with a curved border or connections). But all of them look pretty good to me (definitely better than pointers) and I'm sure sully can make it look even better.

[Robinette]

the 2nd and 3rd ones could be done nicely with a round magnifying glass
with or without a handle...

this is looking like a viable alternative,
sure hope it can work so we can have the world cities of asia included!
nice work son of sdhill

[ender516]

I'm on board with the magnified inset concept, especially if it will aid the progress of this map. It doesn't look out of place on the examples or even very distorted and seems like the solution a professional cartographer would use. The magnifying glass might be a nice touch.

[natty dread]

I don't really buy the idea of a magnifying glass.. Somehow I can't picture it fitting the theme of the map. But let's see what it looks like first, it might surprise me positively.

[WidowMakers]

I really don't see what the hold up is.

We know not everyone will be happy with the names.
Game Play is set.
Let sully pick his cities based on the input he has received and lets go.

DO NOT use a magnifying inset. It will not look right at all. It will confuse and make a great looking look bad.
Do you think that the original classic map names were originally perfect?
I am sure there could have been many arguments as to how the naming of Asia, Africa, Europe and North America could have gone.

If we keep allowing this to go on then we will never get this great map.
Sully has been very cooperative but eventually a decision has to be made and stuck to.

Pointers = NO
Magnify Inset = NO
Map finished = Yes

WM

[AndyDufresne]

From a practical point of view, I'm going to impose a 10-day limit for further discussion about places etc. After November 16th, the places named on the map will be an ever fixéd mark...

Just to reiterate for Benn. :0


--Andy

[porkenbeans]

Click image to enlarge.

For some reason the animation gif is pixelated. But it shows that you can have the legend on one globe. It would need to spin slower of course.

Click image to enlarge.

I like straight lines for all of the connections, because with some of the text needing to go on top of the lines it makes it perfectly clear where the line is going.

[john9blue]

I personally like the soft, pastelly look of Sully's version. Easier on the eyes IMO.

[Brian_c_m]

I LOVE IT!!

Let's roll this puppy out! Great job Sully.

[Robinette]

From a practical point of view, I'm going to impose a 10-day limit for further discussion about places etc. After November 16th, the places named on the map will be an ever fixéd mark...

Just to reiterate for Benn. :0


--Andy

It's all up to sully now!