BeNeLux [Quenched]

[VDB]

No, that's the sign of the city Luxembourg, not the country Luxembourgh.

But thanks for you're suggestion.

Grtz
MarVal

No MarVal, that is the coat and arms of the grand Duchy (the country of Luxemburg). Using the Flemisch Lion, The Walloon Rooster and the Dutch Lion would make things a bit clearer and would at the same time confirm the political realities in Belgium (Federal state, comprising both Flanders and Wallonia)

[MarVal]

So, you're advice is the coat of arms of two countries (the Netherlands and Luxembourg) and two territories (Flemisch and Walloon) instead of the three national flags of Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg?

Only must Belgium divide in two coat of arms? Is the're no coat of arms of Belgium?
- If its an yes; why don't we use that,
- or its a no; will that be logical and clearness for non-Western Europe Conquers of the Club?

Because its the map of BeNeLux and that are the countries of Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg. And not the territories of Flemisch and Walloon separate of BeNeLux?
I think the map is not made for politic statements and so on. The map is for playability, funfactor, and so on.

Everybody can see already in the legenda of the map that Belgium is devided in two big territories, Vlaanderen (Flemisch) and La Walonnie (Walloon). Whats the surplus value too seperate Belgium in two coats of arms?

But I'm also human and might be wrong.
We shall see what others think of this subject.

Grtz
MarVal

[Nikita_2006]

Decide wich period of time you want the map to be on

In the past day's Willem the 3e was the monarch of Holland and Luxemburg, and the Belgian residents decided to live apart.

[Ruben Cassar]

Keep the map exactly as it is, with the current divisions and coat of arms.

It is already accurate the way it is. Belgium is one country divided in regions like Wallonia and Flanders and that's how you have already done the map.

Besides I think the coat of arms are great as they are and anyway they don't affect the gameplay in any way so once again I don't see why people are making a fuss about them being similar. Heck even the flags of Russia and Holland or of Italy and Ireland are similar but that's life!

[RuS]

And yet again, i'd rather see 'kempen' (with a piece of limburg also) than now the extra continent 'brugse ommeland', in belgium, everyone knows 'de kempen' but not everyone knows 'het brugse ommeland'

[happysadfun]

No, that's the sign of the city Luxembourg, not the country Luxembourgh.

But thanks for you're suggestion.

Grtz
MarVal

It says Grand Duchy. Isn't that the country?

BTW, is Grtz your multi account or something?

[onbekende]

Grand Dutchy a country?

no

and grtz is a sort of greetings

[MarVal]

And yet again, i'd rather see 'kempen' (with a piece of limburg also) than now the extra continent 'brugse ommeland', in belgium, everyone knows 'de kempen' but not everyone knows 'het brugse ommeland'

Oké, I agree and find it a good option.
I wait if more people wants De Kempen (the north of Antwerpen and Belgisch Limburg) instead of Brugse Ommeland.
So please people let us know what U think about it?

Grtz
MarVal

And like onbekende says: Grtz means Greetings...

[MarVal]

UPDATE 02

Below the latest development of the map BeNeLux. Look at the first topic to view the map. Some suggestions that were mentioned:

- Country Ostkantone instead of Country Verviers.
- New Coats of arms of Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg.
- Graphics, such as the sea, the landarea around the BeNeLux and the rivers.

So let us know what U think about the map BeNeLux so far.

Grtz
MarVal
member of De Veroveraars Club

[onbekende]

Very nice, I have only 1 thing to say

FINAL FORGE

[Marvaddin]

Before that, let me give another look...

Well, I still dont believe double numbers can fit well in these little circles, but if you tested already, great

Are those dark areas supposed to be hills or something? They are beautiful in pink and green continent, but they arent helping to much in the other areas, specially in light ones where they are not texturized, and mainly in Vlaams Brabant, where it looks like another country, in fact.

About the capitals, can I suggest you change Vlaams Brabant name to Bruxelles, and mark it with a simple star (without the "B") and do the same to other capitals?

I like the ocean. But, the shields are too bright, I believe... And could you try put the names of the continents in the proper colours in the legend? By the way, the title looks like very simplistic, and the map could deserve something more elaborated... why orange, is there a reason (just curious, since you are always posting Benelux in orange, too)?

I suppose you are going to abbreviate some names in the xml, at least, so the drop box wont be gigantic, huh?

About playability, a classic analysis...
Countries, Border countries, Attack routes.
Luxembourg, 3, 1, 2... bonus 1 ok
La Wallonie, 9, 5, 6... bonus could be 6... or you could block the route to neufchateau.
Belgisch Brabant, 2, 2, 6... bonus 2 ok, since you can start already with half of it... or it all
Vlaanderen, 6, 6, 8... for a bonus of 4? And the countries arent connected! Man, this is the most undervalued continent of all maps, not even Africa (classic) can be worse... I would strongly suggest block the routes to the countries to west, and connect the countries, so it would simply suck (with a bonus of 4), but this way and with this bonus its simply the worst ever
Zuid en Oost (Southeast??) Nederland, 9, 5, 7... bonus of 6 could be ok, but I would suggest block at least one attack route, maybe Drenthe.
West Nederland, 9, 7, 8... bonus 6 is too low... Again, maybe blocking some routes...
Noord Nederland, 4, 3, 4,... bonus of 3 is ok.

In fact, most regions have many borders, many of these borders are small and could be easily removed... Some more unpassable, or little adjusts to borders would be greatly benefic. At least, in my opinion... Or, split some continents? A map with, 3 regions of 9 countries each... and at least 5 borders... the greatest wasteland ever, lol... and 3 minor continents. If you dont grab one of these, to where will you run?

Dont stress if your goal is something like this, Im just pointing it, so people can discuss, give alternatives, etc...

[Wisse]

Zuid en Oost (Southeast??) Nederland, 9, 5, 7... bonus of 6 could be ok,

no not southeast but south and east

[MarVal]

Dont stress if your goal is something like this, Im just pointing it, so people can discuss, give alternatives, etc...

No, I will not stress. On the contrary I think you're suggestions are great.
You're quit good of making maps (Like Brazil), so I'm glad you will help use to make a playable gamemap. Thanks.

By the way, Orange is the color of the monarchies.

Grtz
MarVal

P.S.: About the Final Forge. I don't think we can put the map BeNelux into the Final Forge. Only AndyDufresne (our Zookeeper & Foundry Foreman) can do it. Or am I wrong?

[Wisse]

Dont stress if your goal is something like this, Im just pointing it, so people can discuss, give alternatives, etc...

No, I will not stress. On the contrary I think you're suggestions are great.
You're quit good of making maps (Like Brazil), so I'm glad you will help use to make a playable gamemap. Thanks.

By the way, Orange is the color of the monarchies.

Grtz
MarVal

P.S.: About the Final Forge. I don't think we can put the map BeNelux into the Final Forge. Only AndyDufresne (our Zookeeper & Foundry Foreman) can do it. Or am I wrong?

you are right

[happysadfun]

Grand Dutchy a country?

no

and grtz is a sort of greetings

Grand Duchy of Luxembourg is the official name. It is ruled by a Grand Duke, so Grand Duchy is its governmental system.

ah, ok.

[onbekende]

perhaps, don't know the english official name

Dutch: "Groothertogdom Luxemburg"

[Wisse]

call it luxemburg or luxembourg and i'll be fine

[AndyDufresne]

Lets see the most updated version of the map.


--Andy

[MarVal]

Tomorrowevening (European time) I will make the newest update with the suggestions of Marvaddin and others.

Grtz
MarVal

[MarVal]

Lets see the most updated version of the map.

--Andy

Andy,

Below the latest development of the map BeNeLux.

UPDATE 03
Larger map :
(600x456)


(Click to reduce to mapsize 500x380)

Some suggestions that were mentioned:

- Dark areas on the map are gone.
- Capitals stars.
- The ocean less bright.
- Legenda changed.
- In the xml the textures of the countrynames will be shorter.
- La Wallonie 6 extra armies instead of 5..
- Countries in Vlaanderen are connected with eachother.
- Zuid- en Oost-Nederland block one more attack route to Flevoland and Schouwen-Duivenland.
- West Nederland block more attack route to Markizaat and Flevoland.
- 3 continents of 9 countries, 1 continent of 6 countries and 3 minor continents.

So let us know what U think about the map BeNeLux so far.

Grtz
MarVal
member of De Veroveraars Club

[RuS]

Still i'd like to see the continent of 'de kempen' coming. Just cause it's more important in Belgium than 'Brugse Ommeland'.
You can take the West of Limburg and the East of Antwerp (you don't have to get the percise shape.
If you wouldn't adjust these, i'd feel sorry.
But nevertheless, it's your map.

I also would make 'Markizaat' a little bigger to the West, so Antwerpen and Walcheren don't touch anymore.

And a last idea, why don't introduce the 'countries' Voeren and Komen? It's quite a hot item in belgium, cause for example 'Voeren' hasn't got any border with Flandres but is Flemish (it lies against the dutch border in Liege).
Same with Komen but then in the west. And Komen is a part of Wallonie but lies in West-Vlaanderen.

[Marvaddin]

Very few changes about playability. In general lines, its all the same, including Vlaanderen being the worst wasteland in all CC maps. Those changes make it just a bit better, it still needs an urgent bonus upgrade. About playability, I suggest you to split Zuid en Oost Nederland (maybe Zuid Nederland and Oost Nederland, lol) in two areas, each one at one side of that river. In this case, I also suggest:
1) Block Limburg to Belgisch Limburg route.
2) Make Walcheren an island, so it doesnt connect to other continents, even more to 2 continents.
3) Add route Markizaat to Zuid Holland.
4) Remove Waddengebied to Texel route.
5) Remove Dikrech to Neufchateau route (I still dislike it).

I dont know if there is something really terribly wrong about my suggestions, but I want place them.

I still cant understand why dont rename Vlaams Brabant as Bruxelles, and Noord Holland as Amsterdam.

The legend and the title are still not ok... the title is a bit blocky, and in fact I think this orange colour is too bright and a bit out of context, at least to normal mortals. The name of the red are in the legend is a bit difficult to read. And the unpassable borders now look like a fence... the old mountains were much better.

Just my opinion

[RuS]

I still cant understand why dont rename Vlaams Brabant as Bruxelles, and Noord Holland as Amsterdam.

Cause I guess you don't know much about the situation of the provinces in Belgium and Holland? Everywhere the regions are named after REGIONS or Provinces (although he could adjust Neufchateau to Ardennes and Dinant to Condroz). By the way, why should it be in French? In that place they speak Dutch as well.

[Wisse]

I still cant understand why dont rename Vlaams Brabant as Bruxelles, and Noord Holland as Amsterdam.

Cause I guess you don't know much about the situation of the provinces in Belgium and Holland? Everywhere the regions are named after REGIONS or Provinces (although he could adjust Neufchateau to Ardennes and Dinant to Condroz). By the way, why should it be in French? In that place they speak Dutch as well.

don't name noord holland as amsterdam... amsterdam is a city not a province, bruxelles is possible i think

and rus thats because 1/2 of belgium is france

[RuS]

and rus thats because 1/2 of belgium is france

I ment 'Bruxelles' by that, why not just Brussel (it lays completely surrounded by 'Vlaanderen', logical, no?)