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[CC12] R3: FALL (17) vs S&M (29) - S&M Wins - Final 12/8/22

Finished challenges between two competitive clans.

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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby niMic on Sat Oct 08, 2022 11:37 am

xroads wrote:
Extreme Ways wrote:
xroads wrote:My question is, why did you fort back and forth several times for absolutely no reason?

Its odd you can take the time to do that, but dont have the time to click that one last button that says end turn.

I do that, or used to do that, to obfuscate log data. There is a purpose for it and shouldn't really matter in this game imo.


I know it is done a lot, But the fact is he took his time to do all that, but then didnt have time to click that one final button to end the turn.


Didn't you leave the clan because people were not serious enough and made too many mistakes? You should know this is right up my alley.
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby Extreme Ways on Sat Oct 08, 2022 11:44 am

josko.ri wrote:Regardless if the rule is broken or not, I just state my opinion that when punishment has different levels (level 1,2,3 etc) then no bigger levels should be imposed before all lower levels are imposed.

If someone needs to pay 50USD for first offense but 500USD for second offense and then for first offense the offended side told that no punishment should be paid, then second time punishment remains 50USD (level 1) because that person should not go to punshment level 2 if he had never received punishment of level 1.

See example of Clan League. I dont check now, but from memory I recall that there is 6 levels of punishments forbeing late sending games, I think RA once came to the 6th level and got banned.

Then, in Clan League the punishment is imposed only if your opponents opt for punishment. It is not that at the end of Clan League everyone can retroactively count how many times have a clan been late in sending games, and if there is 6 or more infractions then the clan gets banned from the League.

How stupid would that be if so

That would be very reasonable. Otherwise, purposefully missing cards in escalating games you're likely to lose would become a sensible play - at least until you win once and get a remake. After all, as long as you keep losing a likely lost game no penalty will be applied!

Also, the offended side said that they want the game to stand - i.e. their win. That does not mean that no punishment should be or has been paid, just that the option offered to them, a remake, does not better them. Obviously you're not going to ask for a replay on a game you still won.

TOs have not ruled anything yet, but lets review a hypothetical case in which TOs rule it as rule-breaking. The ruling then is 'S&M is at fault, rack up a point in the scale. As a result, FALL is offered a remake of the game in question'. Whether FALL accepts or rejects the remake is not part of the ruling.
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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby Swimmerdude99 on Sat Oct 08, 2022 12:05 pm

I agree. S&M should be fined 50 USD for their first offense.
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby rockfist on Sat Oct 08, 2022 12:16 pm

How can you deduce intent? I sure canā€™t, Iā€™d be incline to say itā€™s not on purpose but any additional violations will be deemed on purpose, but thatā€™s just me.
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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby iAmCaffeine on Sat Oct 08, 2022 12:53 pm

Extreme Ways wrote:The thing I dislike most about all of this is that Josko knows very well what the spirit of the rule is, but argues differently because that benefits his clan.

welcome to josko

no idea how you call him the epitome of fair play btw

dude broken plenty of rules lol
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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby Extreme Ways on Sat Oct 08, 2022 1:11 pm

iAmCaffeine wrote:
Extreme Ways wrote:The thing I dislike most about all of this is that Josko knows very well what the spirit of the rule is, but argues differently because that benefits his clan.

welcome to josko

no idea how you call him the epitome of fair play btw

dude broken plenty of rules lol

No idea how you can't read sarcasm as a Brit, I even highlighted Moonchild.
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby josko.ri on Sat Oct 08, 2022 1:46 pm

GoranZ anyway brought it here just as being vindictive.

If he wanted the game to be remade then his report would have sense as he opt for the punishment level 1 AND reported immediately after nimic's turn, not two days later and the whole one round later.

But he just brought it here publicly, not even asked for punishment to be imposed if it is found that we are guilty.

Similarly, in clan league there is some punishment scale for being late with exchanging games or for using a player in more than maximum games allowed or for using a map than for more than maximum times allowed.

In such cases, game gets remade or whatever other disciplinary measure is in place ONLY if it is reported in round 1of the offended game.

In this case, GoranZ cunningly waited for one full round and two full days to pass since nimic's turn and until his report. In these two days blue still had chance of winning, and only AFTER blue failed and it was obvious that FALL will win then GoranZ came here as a "top fair level" player just to report us but without "asking for a replay".

Therefore GoranZ didnt honestly want to report about the infraction because if he reported it on the time when nimic played that he would risk to ask for replay of a game that otherwise his team might still win. Instead, he came out with this accusation only when it became certain that his team will win and then played like upper hand approach "but we dont want replay". =D>
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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby iAmCaffeine on Sat Oct 08, 2022 2:03 pm

Extreme Ways wrote:
iAmCaffeine wrote:
Extreme Ways wrote:The thing I dislike most about all of this is that Josko knows very well what the spirit of the rule is, but argues differently because that benefits his clan.

welcome to josko

no idea how you call him the epitome of fair play btw

dude broken plenty of rules lol

No idea how you can't read sarcasm as a Brit, I even highlighted Moonchild.

it got masked by the rest of your post
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby iAmCaffeine on Sat Oct 08, 2022 2:04 pm

josko.ri wrote:GoranZ anyway brought it here just as being vindictive.

have you ever just accepted fault? your clan broke the rules. accept it and move on.
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (9) vs S&M (13)

Postby Swimmerdude99 on Sat Oct 08, 2022 2:35 pm

josko.ri wrote:GoranZ anyway brought it here just as being vindictive.

If he wanted the game to be remade then his report would have sense as he opt for the punishment level 1 AND reported immediately after nimic's turn, not two days later and the whole one round later.

But he just brought it here publicly, not even asked for punishment to be imposed if it is found that we are guilty.


Thank you for proving, without any question, what a hypocrite you are. 8-[ :lol:
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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (10) vs S&M (16)

Postby Shannon Apple on Sat Oct 08, 2022 6:42 pm

Josko is just digging himself a hole, and I get it, GoranZ also enjoys drama. I can see that.

On the game-making/joining fiasco, GoranZ was just rabble rousing, causing drama publicly because mods didn't agree with him, and Josko fell into the trap.

But I'm not taking Josko's side in this latest rant. You can't feign knowledge of the rules just because it benefits you or the clan. We are a very old clan, and we know the rules of the site/clan world. Denial of knowledge is just bringing problems for the rest of the clan. People can just look back on other wars and see where it's been mentioned before and call you out on it. That's exactly what happened. People are going to gang up when you do that. So maybe let it go.

For the record, I really think Nimic just forgot to end. It's seems kinda random. It could have happened to any of us. I hate people who use that tactic. If someone was doing that to get advantage, I think it's going to be pretty obvious. They'll have done it at a crucial point in a game, and they'll have done it more than once. People who use cheap tactics, tend to repeat the behaviour and you'll see an obvious pattern of them doing it at a turning point in their games.
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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (10) vs S&M (16)

Postby josko.ri on Sat Oct 08, 2022 7:02 pm

Shannon Apple wrote:Josko is just digging himself a hole, and I get it, GoranZ also enjoys drama. I can see that.

On the game-making/joining fiasco, GoranZ was just rabble rousing, causing drama publicly because mods didn't agree with him, and Josko fell into the trap.

But I'm not taking Josko's side in this latest rant. You can't feign knowledge of the rules just because it benefits you or the clan. We are a very old clan, and we know the rules of the site/clan world. Denial of knowledge is just bringing problems for the rest of the clan. People can just look back on other wars and see where it's been mentioned before and call you out on it. That's exactly what happened. People are going to gang up when you do that. So maybe let it go.

For the record, I really think Nimic just forgot to end. It's seems kinda random. It could have happened to any of us. I hate people who use that tactic. If someone was doing that to get advantage, I think it's going to be pretty obvious. They'll have done it at a crucial point in a game, and they'll have done it more than once. People who use cheap tactics, tend to repeat the behaviour and you'll see an obvious pattern of them doing it at a turning point in their games.

I told that I didnt know about this rule because public opinion inthe thread that I linked showed 78% votes in favor of not having that rule. As a consequence, I would expect the rule to be removed from major CC tournaments but apparently it was not the case. As a consequence, if this rule was broken in CCup then theclan maybget a forfeit but in The Chamionship - Teams valid wins can be achieved using this strategy. Isnt that paradoxical?

I also believe nimic isnot at fault here especially after the other game ww2 europe was also shown to be played the day earlier where he also run out of time but there nimic got the zombie spoil.
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Re: Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (10) vs S&M (16)

Postby xroads on Sat Oct 08, 2022 7:36 pm

Are you really that retarded to think that a rule would be removed from clan challenges because of a meaningless poll in a thread?

Or, is it that you really think we are really that stupid to believe what you are saying.
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (10) vs S&M (16)

Postby josko.ri on Sat Oct 08, 2022 8:11 pm

Yawn.
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (10) vs S&M (16)

Postby xroads on Sat Oct 08, 2022 8:31 pm

josko.ri wrote:Yawn.



Write this down.

Shorted post by Josko ever!
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (10) vs S&M (16)

Postby josko.ri on Sat Oct 08, 2022 11:06 pm

Game 21957649

17th win for S&M is also symbolic in the sense that GoranZ is relegated to the Brigadier rank for the first time since I know him and currently on the lowest score ever since the score gets automatically counted, as shown on his profile.

Welcome to the Brigadier club dear Goran ;)
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Re: [CC12] Semifinals: FALL (17) vs S&M (28)

Postby TeeGee on Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:24 am

Scores update only

S&M win


10 games still remaining, but FALL can now not win from here
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Re: [CC12] R3: FALL (17) vs S&M (29) - S&M Win - Final 12/8/

Postby groovysmurf on Thu Dec 15, 2022 9:13 pm

Congrats to S&M!

War complete, achievements issued, privs removed, topic moved.
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