choosing countries and initial set up.

[dan n]

Here is my problem with this site...the reason the top players all play too many doubles is because singles is all about luck. On your site you never get to pick your own countries or decide how many men you put on each to start. So if you start out with bad countries and you get bad luck on the dice on your 1st turn, then you almost have no chance to win...luck plays to large of a part in a game where strategy is supposed to.At the initial set up of each game, is there any way to allow the players to pick their countries or at least decide where to place their armies ? This would also stop those players from putting all their armies on 1 country and waiting for another player to be even the least bit aggressive. Then that player hording his armies gets his cards and takes out the other player. Once again, I don't believe that's strategy, but sometimes it's the only way to win due to the set up of this site. All I am saying is that the dice should be the only part of this game that luck plays any part in.

[Rogi]

What do you mean by "get to pick your own countries"?
Sure i'd like to have australia or S. America from the start.
The deployment of your armies could be interesting....

[Ronaldinho]

Its fine the way it is.

[dan n]

What I mean is instead of opening up each game at the start and praying that you have been GIVEN countries in good positions, each player would take his turn choosing a country then be allowed to place his armies, maybe 1 at a time or 2 at a time or all at once. The only difficulty would be to have everyone agree on how to do this. You can't give every player 24 hours to choose a country. It would have to happen within a time frame. For example an e-mail would go out to each player stating a time and date to choose etc...If you are not there, or cannot make it then you can drop the game.
At least it would take the luck out of a strategic game...

[Rogi]

Now you messed it up.
The initial suggestion about the deployment of numbers of armies you can place was something to talk about....
The latter suggestion sucks.

[dan n]

I messed up? I "suck". Wow you impress me with your vast vocabulary. At least I am trying improve this game. If you don't like my ideas then instead of insulting me how about you give another suggestion? If you like the "placing of armies" idea then let's talk about that.

[dan n]

Doesn't it frustrate any of you when you open up a game for the 1st time and you know that you have a slim chance to win? That you will need the LUCK of the dice just to have a chance because the initial set up put you at a disadvantage?

[dan n]

why is it fine? Great answer. This is a forum to discuss opinions and all you can say is.."it's fine" Why even bother saying anything at all. Maybe it's fine for you because you need luck to win. Imagine playing chess when every game is set up for you? Don't get me wrong, I know Risk is not chess..just trying to prove a point.

[Rogi]

Sorry, although I don't think i insulted you.
If you make suggestions you have to be prepared to take criticism for them.
The last suggestion you made is a bad one. Really bad. That's my opinion and i do belive i have a right for it. It would take too much time setting up every game and many people would lose interest. Including me.
The suggestion about having an option on how many armies you can deploy on the countries given to you randomly is up for discussion. I support it. Although i think you must have at least 2 armies on each country.
And don't get offended so easy.

[Rogi]

Doesn't it frustrate any of you when you open up a game for the 1st time and you know that you have a slim chance to win? That you will need the LUCK of the dice just to have a chance because the initial set up put you at a disadvantage?

And the answer is NO.
When you play more games you'll see what i mean.
Specially when you play great players who can win when in a really bad position. That's called TACTICS my friend. Play some top 50 players and you'll see what i mean.

[dan n]

I'm not getting offended easily, I just don't appreciate someone saying that my ideas suck without a valid reason. Thank you for giving me one, at least now I can respond. I'm not saying that my idea might work, it could, but there must be a way to do it. If people can actually build a site like this then there must be a way to set it up so that we do not waste too much time and we can take the luck out of the start?

[Rogi]

I see now you actually played a lot of games with good players.
You must have seen them win a game when in a bad position?
You actually played more games than me.
But i still don't think it's luck that you win games.
I do think it is sometimes a benefit that you have great placements on the start. But that's just the way the game is played.

[dan n]

1st of all I have been playing Risk for over 20 years and I also play once a week with some friends. I know how to play. But you just proved my point. Why should we start in a bad position? Why should we have to use tactics like placing all our men on one country and waiting for another player to be the least bit aggressive? thus thinning himself out? We should all start with a level playing field or as close to it as possible.

[Rogi]

On a real board game called RISK that this game is based on you do not have the chance to choose your countries do you?
So why would you have it here?
IT'S RANDOM. Always been.

[nyg5680]

well if u want it done so badely ask lack if it is even possible to implement because form wut i remember every 1 else who has brought up this idea it couldnt be done i could be rong but i dont think i am so ask lack

[dan n]

Anyway, we could talk about this for hours but unless the builders of this site actually can find a way to change the set up, at least letting us place our own armies, then talking will allow me to vent my frustrations and that's it. I guess.

[Nous-irons]

If it was RT, it would work. Otherwise, uh ... not really.

And I don't think singles is all about "bad position". Mostly if you play your politics right - who you decide to attack and not to attack - in a six player FFA especially, that ends up being a larger factor.

[nyg5680]

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2900 there its under pending on lacks to do list

[Rogi]

"Why should we start in a bad position?"
WHO SAYS WE START IN A BAD POSITION?
We all start on the same amount of armies and the same amount of countries. DON'T WE? Don't see your point here. The country's each player recieves is RANDOM. Sometimes you get good placements sometimes you get bad. The difference between good and Great players is great players win games when in bad positions.

[Rogi]

Anyway, we could talk about this for hours but unless the builders of this site actually can find a way to change the set up, at least letting us place our own armies, then talking will allow me to vent my frustrations and that's it. I guess.

I don't think they should.

[nyg5680]

and when in good positions its actually more random than u would think and yes sometimes people get very favorable spots but if you get bad spots u hafta work wit it if u get good spots well than lucky u but it goes both ways for every player in 1 game i started off wit europe and almost eveyr country around it in some other games i hav had my armies split up into every single continent which is fustrating but you hafta work wit it

[dan n]

Look Rogi, I know it's random. When I open my game and I find that my countries are all close together which allows me to go after a continent faster and easier, vs when my countries that I'm given are spaced out all over the map making it more difficult. Your right, sometimes it's to my benefit, but I don't like it when I'm lucky to start either. Especially when you play unlimited and all your countries are connected allowing you to place all your armies on one country. By the way, on the board game you can either choose countries one by one, each players takes his/her turn or you can shuffle the cards and deal them out and whatever card you get you get. I play that each player takes his turn choosing.
Anyway, I checked it out NYG 5860, and you are right. It has been suggested before. Thanks for letting me know.

[nyg5680]

your welcome but pending means its under further review

[dan n]

Hey look guys, it's my opinion. If everyone likes the way it is then fine. It's all about the group not just about me. I was just wondering what other people's opinion's were.
Rogi, you have to chill out. You're getting way to excited for me. I'm outta here.

[nyg5680]

u could have made a poll to see wut the majority thinks instead of me and rogi