End Game: Town Wins! (Island Mafia)

[thechuck51]

Your stating that you blocked me. I stated I targeted Jonty.

Up until this point the only recourse would be for mafia/sk to counter claim. You are in essence saying you blocked me, which would prevent me from attacking Jonty. You are also calling Safari a liar as only one person was blocked.

Jonty does your role include a "Bullet Proof" and was it used"?

No I'm not calling anybody a liar. There could have been multiple blocks but only the ones that prevent a kill make the scene. You said you tried to vig jonty, I blocked you so I think it's my block in the scene. Saf blocked TFO but if it wasn't related to a kill attempt it wouldn't have made the scene.

That doesn't make sense, someone got shot and from the scene looks like he lost his ability to be bulletproof because he looks more cautious now. The other roleblock was very obvious in the scene.

Obviously no two guys were blocked, and it doesn't look like IB was blocked. Things wouldn't really add up if IB was blocked, so I am pretty sure you're lying.

Why is it obvious? did you see a role block in the night 1 scene? so if saf says he blocked somebody night 1 he is lying because there wasn't a block in the scene? No because blocks that don't affect kills generally don't end up in scenes. Also, IB says himself he was blocked so you are wrong on all sides.

I wonder if all this is somehow related to the "hidden theme". Maybe the theme is redundancy, we have detective/backup cop, doctor(?)/backup doc, roleblocker/Joat w/ 1 shot RB. maybe there is a BP and a 1 shot BP too.

Have we heard from gregwolf today? I would like to hear Doom's thoughts as well.

[DoomYoshi]

I haven't quite caught up yet. However, speed wagon is bad. I suggest some people unvote so we can finish the conversation for today. I only half trust claims at LYLO and this is what is happening now.

[DoomYoshi]

Ok, I have caught up. I still need to sort out notes and do a whole game read-through, but it is time for massclaim for sure.

TFO is first. Although, I am 99% sure he is scum - hence the scummaring.

[gregwolf121]

hey yall im back, and dj if you had read my posts you would have known that i did tell yall that i would be gone till well yesterday, and from my reading im inclined to believe sheep, and ill agree that rishaed's play has been pretty bad but im not fully convinced that hes scum so i won't vote, and i would also agree that it is in towns best interest for sheep to investigate who he will without town telling him what to do, as that would tip off scum and they would be free to take evasive actions. that being said im pretty sure we have other protective roles out there and they will need to keep our cop safe, i for one will be watching

I don't know if you are a watcher but if you are and can shed some light on this case you need to come forward asap.

i was wondering when someone would coment on that, but no im not the watcher, i am ajay, bulletproof townie, i said i would be watching hoping that the mafia would see that and target me, thus preventing a kill. based on what has been said, now im inclined to believe that it was IB who was roleblocked by chuck, thats 1 killer acounted for, then we have the serial killer who succeed in his kill, , and that the mafia tried and failed to kill me.
so safs block of TFO didn't effect last nights scene, so im thinking that the mafia/SK are TFO, Jonty and neb, and if their is a third mafia its proabably means that either zimnah or doom is the GF.

so i'll start by vote jonty because i think he is trying to take advantage of the situation by throwing out a plausible claim, given the information IB provided, ie that he was targeted and lived.

fastposted by doom

[zimmah]

Your stating that you blocked me. I stated I targeted Jonty.

Up until this point the only recourse would be for mafia/sk to counter claim. You are in essence saying you blocked me, which would prevent me from attacking Jonty. You are also calling Safari a liar as only one person was blocked.

Jonty does your role include a "Bullet Proof" and was it used"?

No I'm not calling anybody a liar. There could have been multiple blocks but only the ones that prevent a kill make the scene. You said you tried to vig jonty, I blocked you so I think it's my block in the scene. Saf blocked TFO but if it wasn't related to a kill attempt it wouldn't have made the scene.

That doesn't make sense, someone got shot and from the scene looks like he lost his ability to be bulletproof because he looks more cautious now. The other roleblock was very obvious in the scene.

Obviously no two guys were blocked, and it doesn't look like IB was blocked. Things wouldn't really add up if IB was blocked, so I am pretty sure you're lying.

Why is it obvious? did you see a role block in the night 1 scene? so if saf says he blocked somebody night 1 he is lying because there wasn't a block in the scene? No because blocks that don't affect kills generally don't end up in scenes. Also, IB says himself he was blocked so you are wrong on all sides.

I wonder if all this is somehow related to the "hidden theme". Maybe the theme is redundancy, we have detective/backup cop, doctor(?)/backup doc, roleblocker/Joat w/ 1 shot RB. maybe there is a BP and a 1 shot BP too.

Have we heard from gregwolf today? I would like to hear Doom's thoughts as well.

He could have blocked a double voter, or someone who didn't use an action, or someone who did select an action but wasn't able to do it even before the roleblocker blocked. Therefore it wouldn't need to be in the scene.

However you claim to have blocked someone whose action went through (he did shoot someone, and he got wounded). And obviously you weren't roleblocked. Because who would have roleblocked you? Unless mafia has a roleblocker too, but in that case, it'd be likely you'd have a message about it.

When did IB state he was blocked? I don't remember him saying that, in fact it looks like he questions you as we'll, rather than support you. Please quote where IB said he was blocked.

How can redundancy be a theme? I think a theme is more flavor and less roles.

Greg's claim seems simple enough to check, just shoot him some night and if he dies he's a lier.

If he is telling the truth he'll live.

Would be a bit more complex if he was 1 shot BP GF but lets just keep things simple for now.

Either way, it's either IB AND saf lying. Or it's chuck lying.

It seems easier to believe chuck is lying.

It seems like chuck was confused and thought IB claimed that he was blocked by safari, while in fact IB never claimed that, and chuck than claimed to have been blocking IB instead of saf, implying they both lied, but there's a hole in his lie, he misunderstood IB and messed up his claim.

Look at his claim:

Unfortunately things aren't so cut and dry because safari didn't block you, I did. I'm Andrew Town JOAT. I had/have a cop, block, and a vig. So saf's block of TFO didn't prevent a kill and Jonty isn't bulletproof.

It funny that the first line conflicts with the last line. First he thinks saf blocked IB, than he thinks he blocked TFO. (Which is his actual claim). In his confusion he seemed to have miss claimed role blocking IB, while I'm almost 99% sure IB wasn't blocked.

Even if we mislynch chuck, we'll immediatly know that IB and saf are lying.

Are we already at MYLO than? I doubt that.

[thechuck51]

It seems like chuck was confused and thought IB claimed that he was blocked by safari, while in fact IB never claimed that, and chuck than claimed to have been blocking IB instead of saf, implying they both lied, but there's a hole in his lie, he misunderstood IB and messed up his claim.

Look at his claim:

Unfortunately things aren't so cut and dry because safari didn't block you, I did. I'm Andrew Town JOAT. I had/have a cop, block, and a vig. So saf's block of TFO didn't prevent a kill and Jonty isn't bulletproof.

It funny that the first line conflicts with the last line. First he thinks saf blocked IB, than he thinks he blocked TFO. (Which is his actual claim). In his confusion he seemed to have miss claimed role blocking IB, while I'm almost 99% sure IB wasn't blocked.

I'm choosing my words carefully because I am getting frustrated due to your inability to see how the two blocks occurred.

I roleblock IB who has targeted Jonty. Jonty is saved. this would be the part of the scene with the blowdarts or whatever.

Mafia targets gregwolf (BP townie) gregwolf is shot but receovers. this is the first part of the scene

Saf blocks TFO but it does not make it into the scene because it doesn't involve a kill

Is that not possible?

regarding my claim: when I read the scene I figured IB was the 2nd shooter because I blocked him so I guess when saf talked about blocking the kill I confused the two.

[jonty125]

vote gregwolf121, the timing of your claim strikes me as odd. You posted back on page 23 "I think the BP is town". Why didn't you claim then.

[DoomYoshi]

vote gregwolf121, the timing of your claim strikes me as odd. You posted back on page 23 "I think the BP is town". Why didn't you claim then.

What is odd about counterclaiming?

[gregwolf121]

vote gregwolf121, the timing of your claim strikes me as odd. You posted back on page 23 "I think the BP is town". Why didn't you claim then.

the answer is quite simple, if i had claimed then, yes i could have helped clear up what the scene meant, but then the mafia/SK would know i was bulletproof and they would stop trying to NK me, but if i could keep my true power unkown they might have tried again thereby wasting their NK, which would have kept someone else alive.

[Iron Butterfly]

So Chuck why have you not stated what your cop investigation came up? It would seem pretty important for a night one action.

[Iron Butterfly]

Your stating that you blocked me. I stated I targeted Jonty.

Up until this point the only recourse would be for mafia/sk to counter claim. You are in essence saying you blocked me, which would prevent me from attacking Jonty. You are also calling Safari a liar as only one person was blocked.

Jonty does your role include a "Bullet Proof" and was it used"?

No I'm not calling anybody a liar. There could have been multiple blocks but only the ones that prevent a kill make the scene. You said you tried to vig jonty, I blocked you so I think it's my block in the scene. Saf blocked TFO but if it wasn't related to a kill attempt it wouldn't have made the scene.

That doesn't make sense, someone got shot and from the scene looks like he lost his ability to be bulletproof because he looks more cautious now. The other roleblock was very obvious in the scene.

Obviously no two guys were blocked, and it doesn't look like IB was blocked. Things wouldn't really add up if IB was blocked, so I am pretty sure you're lying.

Why is it obvious? did you see a role block in the night 1 scene? so if saf says he blocked somebody night 1 he is lying because there wasn't a block in the scene? No because blocks that don't affect kills generally don't end up in scenes. Also, IB says himself he was blocked so you are wrong on all sides.

I wonder if all this is somehow related to the "hidden theme". Maybe the theme is redundancy, we have detective/backup cop, doctor(?)/backup doc, roleblocker/Joat w/ 1 shot RB. maybe there is a BP and a 1 shot BP too.

Have we heard from gregwolf today? I would like to hear Doom's thoughts as well.

I never said I was blocked Chuck.

I find it interesting that you suggest "[color=#FF0000maybe there is a BP and a 1 shot BP too.][/color]

You then say Have we heard from gregwolf today?

Low and behold gregwolf claims to be a BP Townie. and says if i had claimed then, yes i could have helped clear up what the scene meant, but then the mafia/SK would know i was bulletproof and they would stop trying to NK me, but if i could keep my true power unkown they might have tried again thereby wasting their NK, which would have kept someone else alive.

The night scene specifically implies that the BP targeted was a one shot as the person targeted knew they were no longer safe so this idea that Gregwolf is the one in the night scene is BS.

[zimmah]

It seems like chuck was confused and thought IB claimed that he was blocked by safari, while in fact IB never claimed that, and chuck than claimed to have been blocking IB instead of saf, implying they both lied, but there's a hole in his lie, he misunderstood IB and messed up his claim.

Look at his claim:

Unfortunately things aren't so cut and dry because safari didn't block you, I did. I'm Andrew Town JOAT. I had/have a cop, block, and a vig. So saf's block of TFO didn't prevent a kill and Jonty isn't bulletproof.

It funny that the first line conflicts with the last line. First he thinks saf blocked IB, than he thinks he blocked TFO. (Which is his actual claim). In his confusion he seemed to have miss claimed role blocking IB, while I'm almost 99% sure IB wasn't blocked.

I'm choosing my words carefully because I am getting frustrated due to your inability to see how the two blocks occurred.

I roleblock IB who has targeted Jonty. Jonty is saved. this would be the part of the scene with the blowdarts or whatever.

Mafia targets gregwolf (BP townie) gregwolf is shot but receovers. this is the first part of the scene

Saf blocks TFO but it does not make it into the scene because it doesn't involve a kill

Is that not possible?

regarding my claim: when I read the scene I figured IB was the 2nd shooter because I blocked him so I guess when saf talked about blocking the kill I confused the two.

technically that would be possible, but not plausible, it's easy to fit everything into your story if you know all the details already because of previous claims.

also, you're the only one who is claiming an alternate story while the original story has bits and pieces of multiple persons, none of them contradicting each other, and while they do not contradict you directly either, it'may just be because your story was made up AFTER all the other stories, so you could easily adjust it to fit.

also the scene makes it looks like whoever was shot lost his bulletproof status,

He patched himself up, and went to bed. No more lights on during the night and no more midnight views of the moon, he thought to himself as he dozed to sleep.

If he was truly permanently bulletproof, why would he be more careful from now on?

i just don't buy your claim, it doesn't feel right, and it really feels like you puzzled for hours/minutes to make your story fit with what is publicly available now.

also, you was on the rishead case both day 1 and day 2. (you were one of the earliest people to push for a lynch day 2 IIRC) but what's even more odd is that even though you have pretty unique and strong theories about what happened last night, you did not vote anyone or even FOS'd anyone. surely you must have an idea who scum is since you seem to know a lot about tonight, so why don't you put your money where you mouth is and vote? or at least give your opinion about who you think is scummy?

do you agree with the list and logic IB provided, or do you have an alternative list?

and since you seem to believe greg is permanently bulletproof, what do you think the quoted line from the night scene means?

seems like you spent a bit too much effort to try and make your case waterproof, but the fact that you went through all that effort only makes it more scummy to me. if you'd be truly honest you wouldn't need to brush off that much to make it appear townish, it'd be townish on it's own, without having the need to hold back information or make up information on your own.

[thechuck51]

So Chuck why have you not stated what your cop investigation came up? It would seem pretty important for a night one action.

I got gregwolf as town, that combined with his "watching" post is why I was looking for his input

I never said I was blocked Chuck.

You are right you never said that, I'm not sure where I got that from.

The night scene specifically implies that the BP targeted was a one shot as the person targeted knew they were no longer safe so this idea that Gregwolf is the one in the night scene is BS.

"implies" is the key word. I read it the same way at first too but it's not a stone cold fact. I suppose gregwolf could be mafia GF which would explain the 1-shot part.

also, you was on the rishead case both day 1 and day 2. (you were one of the earliest people to push for a lynch day 2 IIRC) but what's even more odd is that even though you have pretty unique and strong theories about what happened last night, you did not vote anyone or even FOS'd anyone. surely you must have an idea who scum is since you seem to know a lot about tonight, so why don't you put your money where you mouth is and vote? or at least give your opinion about who you think is scummy?

do you agree with the list and logic IB provided, or do you have an alternative list?

and since you seem to believe greg is permanently bulletproof, what do you think the quoted line from the night scene means?

seems like you spent a bit too much effort to try and make your case waterproof, but the fact that you went through all that effort only makes it more scummy to me. if you'd be truly honest you wouldn't need to brush off that much to make it appear townish, it'd be townish on it's own, without having the need to hold back information or make up information on your own.

So I'm scummy for rushing into a lynch on day 2 but scummy for taking my time day 3?

I agree partly with IB's list but the fantastic thing about taking your time to think things through when there is a lot of information and possible scenarios is that sometimes things click and a lightbulb goes off. You want me to vote somebody? how about I vote neb because he is the SK. Whether you use your version of events or mine it comes down to Jonty or Neb as SK and this

*Logistical clarification for me please*
Can someone explain to me who kills with guns and who uses knives? I don't know that it really matters, but N1 the guy was shot and stabbed. N2 the shooter shot a bulletproof player, while the stabber stabbed the backup cop. The only difference it makes to me is to know who targeted the bulletproof player, I think. If it was mafia, then we have a town bulletproof (or bulletproof SK, which is really nasty). If it was the SK, then it tells us nothing (either town or mafia bulletproof).

is a crock of shit, neb has been around enough to know that SK usually kills with a knife

[safariguy5]

For claim purposes, I will say that I blocked aage night 1.

So it's possible that TFO had nothing to do with the kill and that my block on him didn't do anything. Doesn't mean he's scum but doesn't mean he's cleared yet either.

I'm more interested in the bulletproof claims. greg claims he's town bulletproof while jonty is one-shot bulletproof. I don't think it's probable that we have two one-shot bp town players. More likely, the one-shot bp that jonty had was the gf perk. Considering we have a vig, a SK, and a JOAT kill, it makes sense for the GF to have the one-shot bulletproof to help survivability.

We can easily test greg's claim this night with a vig shot.

unvote vote jonty

[new guy1]

Official Vote Count:

Zimmah: Doomyoshi (L-5)
TFO: IB, Sheep, Zimmah (L-3)
Jonty: Gregwolf, Safariguy (L-4)
Gregwolf: Jonty (L-5)
Nebuchadnezer: Chuck (L-5)


With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Deadline is June 20th at around 5:00 PM Server time. Deadline extensions may be requested.

I would also like to remind you all of Rule 10, don't read too far into the scenes. I will not state where this rule needs advising. That is all.

[Iron Butterfly]

For claim purposes, I will say that I blocked aage night 1.

So it's possible that TFO had nothing to do with the kill and that my block on him didn't do anything. Doesn't mean he's scum but doesn't mean he's cleared yet either.

I'm more interested in the bulletproof claims. greg claims he's town bulletproof while jonty is one-shot bulletproof. I don't think it's probable that we have two one-shot bp town players. More likely, the one-shot bp that jonty had was the gf perk. Considering we have a vig, a SK, and a JOAT kill, it makes sense for the GF to have the one-shot bulletproof to help survivability.

We can easily test greg's claim this night with a vig shot.

unvote vote jonty

You have over looked the fact that gregwolf did not claim to be one shot but a bullet proof with multi uses.

You are also giving Chuck the benifit of the doubt about his joat claim?

[safariguy5]

For claim purposes, I will say that I blocked aage night 1.

So it's possible that TFO had nothing to do with the kill and that my block on him didn't do anything. Doesn't mean he's scum but doesn't mean he's cleared yet either.

I'm more interested in the bulletproof claims. greg claims he's town bulletproof while jonty is one-shot bulletproof. I don't think it's probable that we have two one-shot bp town players. More likely, the one-shot bp that jonty had was the gf perk. Considering we have a vig, a SK, and a JOAT kill, it makes sense for the GF to have the one-shot bulletproof to help survivability.

We can easily test greg's claim this night with a vig shot.

unvote vote jonty

You have over looked the fact that gregwolf did not claim to be one shot but a bullet proof with multi uses.

You are also giving Chuck the benifit of the doubt about his joat claim?

There's nothing to suggest that chuck's action directly contradicted your or my action. As of now, I think jonty is the better lead.

[Nebuchadnezer]

Okay, there is a lot of stuff to sort through. This is the information we needed rather than the speed lynch that was forming. Here are my thoughts:

Zimmah – Investigated as town. No known role yet.
Doom – Investigate as town. No known role yet.
Sheep – Claimed cop.
Safari – Claimed roleblocker, blocked TFO N2.
Iron – Vigilante, vigged Jonty N2.
Chuck – JOAT, N1 investigated Greg (town), N2 block Iron.
Jonty – 1 shot BP
Greg – Bullet proof townie.
TFO – unknown.
Neb – unknown.

Analysis: There’s a lot of crap being slung. The more I think about what the options are, the more I get confused.

1. One thing to keep in mind…TFO is silent. Is he hoping that we all overthink this situation, and he lives by default.
2. We were all pretty sure there should be a GF in this game. That makes the investigations on Zimmah, Doom and Greg somewhat suspect...but I overlook it based on #4 and safari's post.
3. Isn’t there a double voter out there? So, between myself, Zimmah, Doom and TFO, one of us is the double voter. I’m betting it’s a mafia voter…most likely TFO, or one of the liars.
4. Either TFO, myself or one of the liars are the SK. Actually, would the SK also have a BP ability? Would that fit Jonty’s claim?
5. I can’t figure out the theme. Anyone else?

I’m on board with voting Jonty. 1-shot BP godfather or 1-shot BP SK makes sense to me. vote Jonty

Sheep should get us some more info tonight, which will button this up nicely.

[jonty125]

Mostly based on WIFOM, I agree but I think zimmah is mafia GF, explaining why he showed up town, and is bulletproof. Also, he could send his goons to go killing people so he was clean against investigative roles. I can understand why people think my 1-shot BP claim is scummy but I can't do anything about my role.

[DoomYoshi]

Neb, if jonty is godfather, why would greg fakeclaim to protect him?

[thechuck51]

Mostly based on WIFOM, I agree but I think zimmah is mafia GF, explaining why he showed up town, and is bulletproof. Also, he could send his goons to go killing people so he was clean against investigative roles. I can understand why people think my 1-shot BP claim is scummy but I can't do anything about my role.

Zimmah is BP?

[jonty125]

Mostly based on WIFOM, I agree but I think zimmah is mafia GF, explaining why he showed up town, and is bulletproof. Also, he could send his goons to go killing people so he was clean against investigative roles. I can understand why people think my 1-shot BP claim is scummy but I can't do anything about my role.

Zimmah is BP?

Scratch that last post. I got zimmah and greg mixed up.

[Nebuchadnezer]

Neb, if jonty is godfather, why would greg fakeclaim to protect him?

Jonty could be either GF or SK.

Did we establish that Greg fakeclaimed? If so, then we should be voting for him, as that would be a for sure mafia member, right? However, I don't think we've established that Greg is faking. Did I miss something?

[zimmah]

I'm not bulletproof. Never was either.

I'm no GF either.

We're not sure if Greg fakeclaimed but it is easy to check by just shooting him once or twice.

If he dies he's a lair and thus deserves to die, and if he's telling the truth it shouldn't matter how often we shoot him.

The only thing is that if he's somehow a one shot bullet proof bad guy and we clear him after not dying from a single shot that we might overlook him late game. Therefore I suggest we make sure to shoot him a second time if it comes to the point where it starts to matter. It's unlikely any bad guy will be permanently bulletproof.

[jonty125]

unlikely any bad guy will be permanently bulletproof.

I agree with that statement.