Dice Complaints and Various Suggestions to Fix Them

by **AK_iceman** on Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:45 pm

CatoTheConquerer wrote:See, that's the problem. is that the Dice Analyzer is showing that the Rolls are at an advantage to the defender.

Can you post a screen shot of your analyzer?

How many total rolls have you done?

by **CatoTheConquerer** on Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:12 pm

So the dice simulator doesn't give anymore predictions than low level ratios. How does the Dice Generator handle large numbers?

by **wicked** on Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:26 pm

Anecdotal evidence: yesterday I auto-attacked 56 v 23 and it ended up 3 v 6. The very next turn, less than one minute later, I was beyond dead, and auto-attacked 7 v 23 and got it down to like 3 v 7. Wish I could've switched those! So OVERALL, my dice averaged out, but no one on here would think either of those outcomes as "fair". So analyze all you want, but the outcome will still be the same.

by **spiesr** on Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:51 pm

Random does not mean fair...so stop complaining

by **shaddowfire** on Thu Jan 25, 2007 9:07 pm

think of all the dice you've rolled in real life...assuming you are 20 years old and you've played maybe one game of risk each week, ever since you were 12, and you roll 450 dice total in a game. You would have rolled 43,200 dice. Conquer Club goes through over 125,000 dice in a day. You are bound to find more upsets, and more weird things.

The other big arguement against this. Try and remember all those time that you've won huge against your opponent. You can't. The human mind remembers tragedy more than victories.

by **CatoTheConquerer** on Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:08 pm

Hey, I'm the first one to admit that dice are NOT fair... if they were the house wouldn't always win. I'm just saying do the dice work the way that they are intended? Or let's start with How Should the dice work? Oh... BTW I had to switch to FireFox to start tracking my dice rolls, and no, firefox does not make my rolls better.

by **LetGodSortThem** on Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:56 pm

Hey if anybody thinks they can roll real dice better...Go to Vegas or quit your bitching... the dice are against me...gimme a break, everybody else seems to get along fine...I've lost 18 armies eliminating 4 - 1 army territories...poop occures...

by **AtomicSlug** on Fri Jan 26, 2007 1:04 pm

I have an Open Office Calc and (converted) Excel 97/2000/XP spreadsheet that, if you enter the attacker and defender dice, will give you the deviance from the theoretical values.

I'm in beta testing phase. I have two players on another site (one for Open Office and one for Excel). I could use 2 beta testers here (again, one for Open Office, one for Excel).

First two serious replies by PM or email will get the spreadsheet to play with and see actually how fair it is! :-)

(I will need your email though, so if you PM me, please provide it)

PM or email me @ atomicslug@hughes.net
experienced and patient players only please (you have to enter each of the rolls manually, but alt-tab comes in handy, and is quite usable).

by **wicked** on Fri Jan 26, 2007 1:43 pm

spiesr wrote:Random does not mean fair...so stop complaining

Sweet, I like that. Will add it to my list of quotes. :twisted:

by **nyg5680** on Fri Jan 26, 2007 5:51 pm

i believe their random

by **oaktown** on Sun Jan 28, 2007 7:25 pm

we're dealing with rolls of dice, so it's a game of luck... sometimes you have bad luck, sometimes you have good. And no, a game that relies on random luck will rarely seem abslutely "fair," though it should be over the long haul.

That said, I've seen a strange trend in the past three weeks... when attacking with 3 armies v. 1 defender, I find that if the defender rolls a six on the first attack, he will continue to roll sixes - on some occasions up to eight times. Now, this can certainly occur when the dice are entirely random, and it can happen playing at home with real dice, but this has happened to me so many times iin the past weeks that it is effecting the way I play. The attacker should win a 3-1 roll 65% of the time, but I've found that in my run of odd dice rolls it's been more like 25%.

I don't think anybody is out to get me personally, nor do I think that it is in anybody's interest to weight the dice. And the above phenomenon is probably nothing but lousy luck. But it is possible that the current system could be imperfect.

by **notkin** on Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:25 pm

a computer cannot make it actually random, just have a long enough sequence that it seems random. And the dice arent saying, "Oh, its you, we'll give you crappy roles." Everbody gets good roles, everybody gets bad roles.

I was playing risk in real life, i know it sounds crazy) and lost with 30 guys to 10, so it happens in real life too.

by **KnightWulfe** on Thu Feb 08, 2007 6:52 pm

How about finding a more realistic and intuitive die rolling algorithm? Gotta say, the one this site uses is about the worst one I have ever experienced.

by **AndyDufresne** on Thu Feb 08, 2007 6:53 pm

Quit complaining.

--Andy

by **notkin** on Thu Feb 08, 2007 7:10 pm

I dont think it really matters because everyone has the same dice so what comes around goes around.

by **lVlaniac** on Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:47 pm

andy is right maybe what it could be disscused is when someone looses instead of putting a bid YOU LOOSE you could change loose from black to red and YOU WIN from black to green or something like that

by **hecter** on Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:52 pm

When playing REAL risk, you know, with the little dudes, and real dice, i once took out like 30 guys with my 30 guys, and i lost 5 ppl MAX. No i wasnt cheating. So that should just show you that the dice algorithm is pretty good. By the way, you dont seem to complain when some1 attacks your 3 guys with 15, and you hold the continent. Like andy said, QUIT COMPLAINING! Instead, try to suggest something useful like a new game mode, or how to deal with the deadbeating problem.

by **lVlaniac** on Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:55 pm

yeah quit complaining :lol:

by **pancakemix** on Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:13 pm

I have no complaints about the dice. This has been no'd before anyway.

by **kclborat** on Sat Feb 10, 2007 3:12 am

they're true random numbers. what more could you ask for?

by **ericisshort** on Sat Feb 10, 2007 4:02 am

what algorithm is currently being used?

...or is that top secret <sarcasm> to prevent all the hax0rs?</sarcasm> :roll:

by **Atilla** on Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:00 pm

The disadvantage the attacker has making dice rolls are making the game almost not worth playing...at least not fun when you blow 10 men trying to take a country with 1 on it..

Can a different dice roll calculator be used or the exsisting one tweaked?

Sincerly getting bored with outragious losses,

Atilla

by **everywhere116** on Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:08 pm

The dice roll is completely random. The reason these threads keep popping up is that there are so many dice roled on CC.

by **AndyDufresne** on Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:38 pm

I actually played a good old fashioned board game of world domination yesterday, and I had some horrendous (and wonderful) rolls with real dice. At one time, I was attacking 10 vs 15 and only lost 3 troops and conquered. At another time I had well over 20 armies and lost to 12.

--Andy

by **khazalid** on Mon Feb 19, 2007 7:28 pm

yep, i still play board risk now and then. last time i played im pretty sure i managed to lose 14 armies in a row attacking...

cc dice arent that bad and furthermore it happens to everyone.

if youre worried about attacking then play a more defensive game